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Evidence-based GLP-1 & peptide discussion since 2023
ForumsPharmacology & MechanismsMy pharmacist tried to explain the mechanism and my eyes glazed over — looking for input

My pharmacist tried to explain the mechanism and my eyes glazed over — looking for input

hannah_MT Mon, Oct 14, 2024 at 3:59 AM 13 replies 1,633 viewsPage 1 of 3
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hannah_MT
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Oct 14, 2024 at 5:24 AM#1
Retatrutide (LY3437943) is the first triple incretin agonist (GIP/GLP-1/glucagon) to show Phase 2 data, and the results are staggering — up to 24.2% weight loss at 48 weeks. The glucagon receptor (GCGR) component is the differentiator, and I want to discuss the thermogenic mechanisms. The glucagon receptor is a Class B GPCR expressed primarily in liver, but also in: - Brown adipose tissue (BAT) - White adipose tissue (WAT) — at lower levels - Heart - Kidney - Brain (moderate levels in hypothalamus) > "Retatrutide is a single peptide agonist of the GIP, GLP-1, and glucagon receptors with EC₅₀ values of 0.16, 2.03, and 1.39 nM, respectively, demonstrating full agonist activity at all three receptors." > — Coskun et al., *Cell Metabolism*, 2022; 34:1234–1247 The estimated contribution of GCGR agonism to the total weight loss effect is ~5-7 percentage points above what GIP/GLP-1 dual agonism alone achieves. Where does this extra weight loss come from? The leading hypothesis is INCREASED ENERGY EXPENDITURE rather than further appetite suppression.
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Dr.RheumBOS
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Boston, MA
Oct 14, 2024 at 5:41 AM#2
Glucagon's effects on energy expenditure operate through at least three distinct mechanisms. Let me detail each: 1. BAT thermogenesis (direct GCGR activation): Glucagon receptor activation on brown adipocytes stimulates: - Lipolysis (HSL/ATGL activation via PKA) - UCP1 transcription (via p38 MAPK → PGC-1α → UCP1 promoter) - Mitochondrial biogenesis - FFA oxidation and heat generation > "Acute glucagon infusion in healthy volunteers increased resting energy expenditure by 210 ± 45 kcal/day, an effect that correlated with supraclavicular BAT temperature measured by infrared thermography (r=0.72, P=0.003)." > — Salem et al., *Diabetes*, 2016; 65(8):2235–2244 2. Hepatic futile cycling: GCGR activation in liver stimulates: - Glycogenolysis → glucose release - Gluconeogenesis from amino acids (energetically expensive) - Urea cycle activation (requires 4 ATP/urea molecule) - Fatty acid oxidation → ketogenesis The hepatic "futile cycles" (simultaneous glycogenolysis + gluconeogenesis, or lipogenesis + β-oxidation) dissipate energy as heat. This may account for a significant portion of the energy expenditure increase. 3. Amino acid catabolism: Glucagon profoundly stimulates amino acid uptake and catabolism in the liver. The conversion of amino acids to glucose (gluconeogenesis) is highly thermogenic — approximately 33% of the amino acid's energy is lost as heat during conversion.
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nancy_portland
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Portland, ME
Oct 14, 2024 at 5:58 AM#3
The amino acid catabolism angle is fascinating and underappreciated. Let me quantify it: Glucagon stimulates hepatic amino acid uptake primarily by: - Upregulating the SLC38A2 (SNAT2) amino acid transporter - Activating glutamate dehydrogenase - Inducing urea cycle enzymes (CPS1, ASS1, ASL) The energetic cost of converting amino acids to glucose: - Alanine → glucose: ~35% energy loss as heat - Glutamine → glucose: ~40% energy loss as heat - Branched-chain AAs: even more costly (requires multiple transamination steps) > "Chronic glucagon receptor agonism in diet-induced obese mice reduced circulating amino acid concentrations by 30-45% and increased hepatic urea production by 2.4-fold, accounting for an estimated 150-200 kcal/day increase in energy expenditure from amino acid catabolism alone." > — Kim et al., *Cell Metabolism*, 2017; 26(3):459–471 This has an important clinical implication: retatrutide may cause lean mass loss through excessive amino acid catabolism. The Phase 2 data showed that ~30% of the weight lost was lean mass (similar to other GLP-1RAs, but absolute lean mass loss was greater due to greater total weight loss). This raises the question of whether protein supplementation should be routinely recommended with retatrutide more so than with GLP-1RA monotherapy.
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MikeFit_NJ
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Apr 2024
New Jersey
Oct 14, 2024 at 6:15 AM#4
The hepatic safety profile is the elephant in the room for GCGR agonism. Let me address this directly. The glucagon paradox for the liver: GCGR agonism acutely stimulates hepatic glucose output (HGO) — this is the "diabetogenic" action of glucagon. In a Type 2 diabetes patient with already-elevated HGO, adding more glucagon seems counterproductive. But the GLP-1 and GIP components of retatrutide mitigate this: - GLP-1 → insulin secretion → hepatic insulin sensitization → suppresses HGO - GIP → insulin secretion → additional HGO suppression - Net effect: the insulin-mediated suppression outweighs the direct glucagon-mediated stimulation > "In the Phase 2 trial, retatrutide produced dose-dependent HbA1c reductions of up to −2.16% despite containing a full glucagon receptor agonist, confirming that the insulin secretory effects of the GIP/GLP-1 components sufficiently counteract glucagon-driven hepatic glucose output." > — Jastreboff et al., *New England Journal of Medicine*, 2023; 389:514–526 The liver fat angle: GCGR agonism also promotes hepatic fatty acid oxidation and reduces hepatic de novo lipogenesis. In preclinical models, this dramatically reduces liver fat: > "Chronic GCGR agonism reduced hepatic triglyceride content by 65% in diet-induced obese mice through upregulation of CPT1a-mediated fatty acid oxidation and suppression of SREBP-1c-driven lipogenesis." > — Pocai et al., *Diabetes*, 2009; 58(10):2258–2266 This positions retatrutide as potentially superior for MASLD/MASH, where hepatic fat reduction is the primary therapeutic goal. The Phase 2 subgroup with MASLD showed remarkable liver fat reductions.
Last edited: Oct 14, 2024 at 9:15 AM
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PeptideSynthNJ
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Princeton, NJ
Oct 14, 2024 at 6:32 AM#5
Great comprehensive overview. Let me add the BAT-specific data because this is my area. Human BAT is more relevant than many clinicians realize. PET-CT studies show metabolically active BAT in the supraclavicular, paravertebral, and perirenal depots. Its contribution to total energy expenditure is estimated at 50-200 kcal/day when fully activated. Glucagon's BAT activation pathway (described in detail): 1. GCGR activation → Gαs → cAMP → PKA 2. PKA phosphorylates HSL → lipolysis → FFA release 3. FFAs serve as both UCP1 substrates AND allosteric UCP1 activators 4. PKA also activates p38 MAPK → ATF2 → PGC-1α → UCP1 transcription 5. UCP1 dissipates the mitochondrial proton gradient as heat > "Glucagon-stimulated BAT thermogenesis requires functional UCP1, as demonstrated by the complete abolition of glucagon-induced energy expenditure increase in UCP1-knockout mice, confirming that UCP1-mediated uncoupling is the primary effector mechanism." > — Beaudry et al., *Cell Reports, 2019; 27(12):3480–3489 The WAT browning question: Can chronic GCGR agonism promote "browning" of white adipose tissue (beige adipocyte recruitment)? Animal data says yes: Chronic GcgR agonism for 14 days increased UCP1 mRNA by 8-fold in inguinal WAT and increased multilocular adipocyte density by 3-fold. If this translates to humans, the chronic thermogenic effect could be substantially greater than the acute effect.
Last edited: Oct 14, 2024 at 10:32 AM
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